Opinions on Rogues (Holler's Old Omega Essay)

So then that also implies that characters like Zealot were totally possible as well.

Here we go again with the rogue talk again lol. I don't really think that rogues should cause so much trouble, I mean, for one they are not really impossibly uncannon. They could happen in the half life 2 universe. Honestly, of the millions of CCA units. At least one is going to crack. Maybe not at a high rank when brain washing is too high, but still. The brain doesn't work the same for everybody. Brainwashing doesn't erase memory, it blocks it. There are so many different circumstances for a Rogue unit to arise that I cannot name them all. But one thing I never really understood was, why are they the hugest problem ever? Yes they are a rare occurrence but they make sense.

People often associate them as these super men/women with super mega ultra survival power which they don't have. All they are is a CCA unit of whatever skill level their rank corresponds with, just not part of the UU anymore, that's it. Sure they may have training and such, but they are one person who is now acting on their own will, free of the UU. The CCA can track them down and they bring trouble with them. So my next question would be, why don't the CCA just kill them instead of complaining about how rogues are uncannon? If they could track them via bio-signal or something like that, why not just kill them? I think rogues make for an excellent element of RP. And I don't really think it would be impossible for them to happen, because nothing really is impossible. What people need to realize however which I realized after making this, is. You don't choose to rogue, you don't plan to rogue, the circumstances need to play out especially for you to rogue, just as they would for the unit ICLY. The only reason it causes problems OOCLY is jealousy, but that is just because they are stereo-typed as invincible, which they are not. The circumstances would have to play out perfectly for it to happen.

This is not really a rant more than it is an opinion based argument with some facts, I don't mean to have any biased opinions on any of what I have stated, it is just my take on rogues.

Watch this video as a representation of what I mean, you have a teacher, who is telling the class about this group called the wave, which represents strength with Discipline, action and community, calling it the wave. At first everybody is encouraged to abide by all of the rules and it even brings people rejected by the class together and unites them. But as people start to remember their own instinct as everybody thinks differently and reacts to different situations, some start to crack and oppress, and pretty much go rogue.



Teacher= UU
Oppressive Girl (Lorry or Whatever)= Pre-Rogue Unit

Crucial part is 19:29 up to about 24:00

Idk just my take on it guys, I'm pretty tired.

I realized later it was poor of me to write such an essay about Omega on something so uneasily acquired... I didn't really have my head fully rapped around the workings of rogues. One thing is for certain, not everybody should have them, and nobody should ever try or exploit/secretively rogue without a sufficient developmental reason.

Honestly I love the creativity, but rogues have had just such a bad reputation in the community. I personally don't like them because they have access to everything, and pretty much dominate everyone. It also leads to people wanting rogues too since they may think it's unfair. My only personal exception would be someone that had a story along the lines of Barney.

I'm neutral

I think since the only rouge that I actually think should be a rouge has a broken HD, rouges shouldn't exist for a time. Noobs Phantom is only "okay" because he had it before I owned TC and I still see no reason to remove it from him simply 'because'.

But, I do think they are a negative to the over all gameplay. BUT. I still think random event characters are a good idea. Special characters like that could pop up rarely and get a few players to help them with a small task. Fun, and you got to play with someone you probably heard stories about.

My view is that the simple existence of rogues wasn't the problems, it's how they were RPed. A lot of them are RPed as having level 100 sneak skill, living in these impossible to reach or meta-shielded locations(meta-shielded=you go in and instantly someone calls meta). The only place I couldn't really say that for was the sanctuary in City 45, because it seems like some amount of RP was put into that prior to my arrival to HL2RP. The only real difference between a rogue unit and a refugee is that a rogue would probably have a little more expertise with weapons, a bit of knowledge of Civil Protection operations, and possibly being somewhat emotionally bankrupt. That's about it.

General Bravo wrote:My view is that the simple existence of rogues wasn't the problems, it's how they were RPed. A lot of them are RPed as having level 100 sneak skill, living in these impossible to reach or meta-shielded locations(meta-shielded=you go in and instantly someone calls meta). The only place I couldn't really say that for was the sanctuary in City 45, because it seems like some amount of RP was put into that prior to my arrival to HL2RP. The only real difference between a rogue unit and a refugee is that a rogue would probably have a little more expertise with weapons, a bit of knowledge of Civil Protection operations, and possibly being somewhat emotionally bankrupt. That's about it.

I agree, if they were RP'ed correctly and not as super T-1000's, then I would love to see some new rouges. But they are being RP'ed to have super powers and having no fear.
Maybe a small RP guide for rouges that they should follow?
And if a new rouge has emerged, then they CCA should make killing that rouge the first thing on their agenda. This will make having a rouge be hard and not so OP.

Slashraider wrote:

General Bravo wrote:My view is that the simple existence of rogues wasn't the problems, it's how they were RPed. A lot of them are RPed as having level 100 sneak skill, living in these impossible to reach or meta-shielded locations(meta-shielded=you go in and instantly someone calls meta). The only place I couldn't really say that for was the sanctuary in City 45, because it seems like some amount of RP was put into that prior to my arrival to HL2RP. The only real difference between a rogue unit and a refugee is that a rogue would probably have a little more expertise with weapons, a bit of knowledge of Civil Protection operations, and possibly being somewhat emotionally bankrupt. That's about it.

I agree, if they were RP'ed correctly and not as super T-1000's, then I would love to see some new rouges. But they are being RP'ed to have super powers and having no fear.
Maybe a small RP guide for rouges that they should follow?
And if a new rouge has emerged, then they CCA should make killing that rouge the first thing on their agenda. This will make having a rouge be hard and not so OP.

I'm pretty much on the same boat, but everybody shouldn't just stereo-type every rogue as like Phantom, who does have a lot of experience and training. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Noob T-1000's. I am saying, people don't realize that rogue, doesn't just mean, you go out and join the super rogue club or the rebels but you are all kick-ass right off the bat. No, you live by your own rules now, you live by your own will now. Rogue should be like everybody else, just a different asset of character that is uncommon.

This. ^

I had a conversation with Zaughi about rogues and this is what we came up with and I think it's a pretty good idea. Rogues can be made by anyone with the proper RP if they can successfully escape, etc, etc. However, once a new rogue is made then the CCA will have make killing that rogue a number one thing to do. They will sweep almost constantly, (not constantly but VERY OFTEN) they will destroy buildings, kill refugees and possible resistance members. If a rogue wants to help out the resistance, why be the cause of 10000 sweeps just to be with them? It doesn't make since and a rogue wouldn't want that to happen if he was in favor of the resistance side.

Another point is that the resistance or refugees wouldn't instantly know that specific CCA unit is a rogue, even if he told them he was. They could think he/she is a spy or another one of the UU's tricks. They wouldn't trust nor let him/her stay and would most likely kill him/her.

There should also be some passive RP that goes along with it. CCA rogues will be weak as fuck when they first start out... They are used to the steroidish supplements giving to them by the UU and then they go to eating rotting takeout while sitting in the mud.

It will be hard to adjust...

There's more but I'm really tired so I'll save it for a later discussions.


TL;DR:
Anyone can be rogues but it will be hard as shit and not very efficient to helping the resistance with them running with guns and saying "Guys im on your side now!" with 69,000 OTA units chasing after the rogue looking to deal some damage.

Slashraider wrote:This. ^

I had a conversation with Zaughi about rogues and this is what we came up with and I think it's a pretty good idea. Rogues can be made by anyone with the proper RP if they can successfully escape, etc, etc. However, once a new rogue is made then the CCA will have make killing that rogue a number one thing to do. They will sweep almost constantly, (not constantly but VERY OFTEN) they will destroy buildings, kill refugees and possible resistance members. If a rogue wants to help out the resistance, why be the cause of 10000 sweeps just to be with them? It doesn't make since and a rogue wouldn't want that to happen if he was in favor of the resistance side.

Another point is that the resistance or refugees wouldn't instantly know that specific CCA unit is a rogue, even if he told them he was. They could think he/she is a spy or another one of the UU's tricks. They wouldn't trust nor let him/her stay and would most likely kill him/her.

There should also be some passive RP that goes along with it. CCA rogues will be weak as fuck when they first start out... They are used to the steroidish supplements giving to them by the UU and then they go to eating rotting takeout while sitting in the mud.

It will be hard to adjust...

There's more but I'm really tired so I'll save it for a later discussions.


TL;DR:
Anyone can be rogues but it will be hard as shit and not very efficient to helping the resistance with them running with guns and saying "Guys im on your side now!" with 69,000 OTA units chasing after the rogue looking to deal some damage.

Meh I say, keep rogues as uncommon as possible, if the CCA wants to make them a high priority target, they will be dead, simple as that. Why waste resources and time just to get one unit that has nothing? Nobody should ever choose to be a rogue, they should be seldom heard off. But I still think they should exist. I just don't think they should be overpowered as fuck. No offense to this idea, but it's labeling rogues as a common occurrence and I foresee this idea causing problems. In another sense, it just makes rogues extremely pointless.

If they were important to the CCA, the CCA will have to think about getting that mofo terminated asap. But I don't think we should really open up roguing to everybody so willingly with a huge negative. That's like saying, "You can have the cracker Polly, but just know that I'mma get every mother fucking bird in this neighborhood on your ass until they get it off you." In my opinion, rogues should be more of a secretive thing, that nobody really knows about. They should be in hiding, constantly on the move and such. The main primary thing that should know about the rogue is the CCA, and they won't even really notice right away.

Making the Rogue the primary objective of the CCA until he/she is killed is highly unnecessary considering what they gain and what work they get done and even all the shit it takes to take them down while other shit is happening that is more important is going on.

When I first joined TC, rogues were pretty powerful, but I still liked how they operated, I would like it like that, but I would like them a bit more scarce, less overpowered (if they become trained over time such as phantom than it is not really overpowered), and I want them to be different than the stereo-typical join up with the rebels or help Phantom enclave (No offense Noob) Rogues. Diversity is what balances successful RP. The Key is to balance them so they are fair, then we can implement them with no problems.